Curse

Div · Apr 16, 2008, 05:28 PM // 17:28

Just a beginner's guide (and by beginner, I mean 99% of the GW population).

As the title implies, maximum energy is not the same as emanagement. Once you've burned through all your energy in the midst of battle, you simply can't output more pressure until your energy recovers. On the other hand, if you have adequate energy management, you can keep going despite having a lower maximum energy.

Say two players have the same damage output. After natural regen and any emanagement skills they have, Player A uses an average of 20 energy every 4 seconds, and Player B uses 10 energy every 4 seconds. Before the battle, Player A repeatedly pings his energy as "I have 105 of 105 energy!", thinking that he's good or something. He sustains his damage output for about 20 seconds before burning out (if he even survives that long with his sup estorage and attunement runes). Player B, on the other hand, only has 70 energy. However, his superior emanagement allows him to keep going for almost 50% longer than Player A.

So kids, the lesson here is that emanagement is better than maximum energy, at least in most cases as a caster unless you really need the quick burst of damage to finish something off without sustainability.

Addendum: I see a lot of discussion goes towards the MB ele, but remember, monks sitting in a 15/-1 set and attunement runes with 70 energy are bad. It's just sad when people offer advice such as "use a 15/-1 weapon for this build so you can cast more." You cast more in the long run by having good energy management, not maximum energy.

lietzaum · Apr 16, 2008, 05:41 PM // 17:41

i agree while you might have more energy if you don't manage it well there is not reason to have any energy at all, or halfway into each battle they will want a battery or after the battle they say i need regen while if you have energy management you can go and still have enough damage to kill the enemy this does mean you have to pick your skills more carefully then the other builds but in the long run you will find the skills that will work for you

jiggles · Apr 16, 2008, 06:01 PM // 18:01

there is absolutley no reason whatsoever to have 100+ energy

Nice 'guide' btw ^^

Mouse at Large · Apr 16, 2008, 06:08 PM // 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by jiggles

there is absolutley no reason whatsoever to have 100+ energy

Nice 'guide' btw ^^

Not entirely true. Try running a Mind Blast bar. With a high initial energy pool, especially if you are running a +15/-1 item, provided you don't spam spells beneath MB's breakpoint, the intital 100+ energy is a good starting point.

In PvP, you may well equipment swap to juggle the extra regen pip v overall pool, but in most PvE, and with the caveat above, 100+ and 3 pips works fine with MB.

Trvth Jvstice · Apr 16, 2008, 06:18 PM // 18:18

Have the best of both worlds, carry an extra weapon set with +energy -1energy regen. Equip the + energy weapon set, call your energy then switch back to your regular weapons. My Monk has 90+ energy with my energy set equiped.

I know that's not the point of the thread, but it's usually only new eles that I see calling such high energy pools.

Racthoh · Apr 16, 2008, 06:36 PM // 18:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mouse at Large

Not entirely true. Try running a Mind Blast bar. With a high initial energy pool, especially if you are running a +15/-1 item, provided you don't spam spells beneath MB's breakpoint, the intital 100+ energy is a good starting point.

Using a 15/-1 item all the time is bad.

Mouse at Large · Apr 16, 2008, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

Using a 15/-1 item all the time is bad.

.......and if you'd quoted all of my post and not just a selected sentence, you would have seen that's what I said.

"most" is not "all"

pace

*lemming* · Apr 16, 2008, 09:18 PM // 21:18

Mind Blas is energy management.

-___________________-

Racthoh · Apr 16, 2008, 09:51 PM // 21:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mouse at Large

.......and if you'd quoted all of my post and not just a selected sentence, you would have seen that's what I said.

"most" is not "all"

pace

There is never a reason to sit on a -energy regen item, you're just denying yourself energy by doing so. The only time you use those items is briefly to borrow energy. Swap -> cast -> swap back. Just because 100 energy and 3 pips works doesn't mean you should do it; you're losing a HCR or HCT by doing so.

freaky naughty · Apr 16, 2008, 10:04 PM // 22:04

For an ele (pretty much the only profession sporting such high energy) max energy is pretty much good e-management as said before with mind blast.

bj91x · Apr 17, 2008, 01:21 AM // 01:21

Max energy "is" "part" of e-management... They're not different things...

If you have high energy and your e-management comes through using an active skill like Energy Drain, then you'll be able to cast more spells before you have to use your energy regain spells. Sometimes, you won't even need to use your energy regain spells if the fight ends short enough. In addition, by having a higher energy pool, you may get more energy gain from active energy regain spells. If your max energy is too low you may not gain all the energy regain benefits. True for skills that give you a lot of energy in return. An example is Auspicious Incantation combined with a 15+ energy skill. At Inspiration rank 12, you would gain 27 energy. If you are at 40 max energy and use AI at 20 energy (since you'd need 20 base energy to use this combo), you lose out on 7 extra energy. If you're using it on a 25 energy skill, your total possible gain would be 46. Since you'd have to start with 30 energy, you lose out on 36 energy.

The higher energy you have, the less times you have to spend with active energy regain spells and may gain more benefit from active energy regain spells.

It's the same with passive gains. Any spells like Attunes or N's Soul Reaping. If you're N is at 30/40 when two enemies die, you'd lose out on some good energy. But if you have 30/50 when an enemy dies, you'd gain a lot more. Also, though there are builds that will never run out of energy, there are plenty of situations and builds where you will slowly lose energy even with good e-management. Since you'll slowly lose energy, who will fight longer? A player with higher energy pool? Or a player with low energy pool?

The higher energy you have, you may benefit more from passive energy regains and last longer in battle.

In the end, a good energy management is the right balance between good enough energy regain for the build you're running AND high enough energy pool for the build that you're running. Not one or the other.

On a side note, I seriously recommend trying out different skill combinations so that you don't lose out on the 1 extra energy regen by using a 15/-1 "most" of the time. 15 extra energy for trading off 1 energy regen is not a good balance. It's a rip off. I'm sure there are builds that will make good use of that focus, but for the most part, it's a complete rip off.

Splitisoda · Apr 17, 2008, 01:24 AM // 01:24

I find energy-management in places like AB, highly overated. Your gonna respawn with max energy, might as well just leeroy in

, sides, if you ever see on my warrior, your gonna see a dude with about 70-80 energy.

Savio · Apr 17, 2008, 02:10 AM // 02:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by bj91x

If you are at 40 max energy and use AI at 20 energy (since you'd need 20 base energy to use this combo), you lose out on 7 extra energy.

Or you use AI at 10 energy, swap to your high energy set, cast the other spell, then swap back.

Quote:

In the end, a good energy management is the right balance between good enough energy regain for the build you're running AND high enough energy pool for the build that you're running. Not one or the other.

You aren't balancing between e-management and a high energy pool. High energy pools are at the expense of health, attribute points, other runes, and more useful weapons. And really, for what builds is it mandatory to have more max energy beyond what you already have?

Quote:

I'm sure there are builds that will make good use of that focus, but for the most part, it's a complete rip off.

Good players will have a 15/-1 set. They just don't run around with it 24/7.

Another useful topic for Divine to make would be "Weapon swapping: you can use more than one weapon!"

bj91x · Apr 17, 2008, 03:53 AM // 03:53

Quote:

You aren't balancing between e-management and a high energy pool. High energy pools are at the expense of health, attribute points, other runes, and more useful weapons. And really, for what builds is it mandatory to have more max energy beyond what you already have?

When did I say to sacrifice HP/armor insignias, runes, etc. for max energy?

"right balance between good enough energy regain for the build you're running AND high enough energy pool for the build that you're running"

You ARE balancing between good enough energy regain, high enough energy pool, and other insignias, runes, mods, etc. Or at least you should be. I never said to always go full Radiant, Attunemnent etc. It is about balance for the build that you are running. If the build you're using requires a lot of Radiant and doesn't need extra HP or armor, then great. Go with full Radiant by all means. That is the right balance for that build since the extra HP, armor, etc. is a waste. The key point is balance for the build that you're running. It's not as black and white as high HP is always better than high energy or that "max" energy is always better than extra HP, etc.

Quote:

Good players will have a 15/-1 set. They just don't run around with it 24/7.

My bad for not making this clear. While making this thread, I deleted the comment referring to players running with 15/-1 "most" of the time. The post is edited to remove confusions.

Racthoh · Apr 17, 2008, 06:59 AM // 06:59

Running around with a 15/-1 set is bad, a 30/-2 is twice as good. If you're using a 15/-1 and a 30/-2 that means you've lost your efficiency, shield, or enchanting set. Every caster AFAIK can take advantage of each.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Savio

Another useful topic for Divine to make would be "Weapon swapping: you can use more than one weapon!"

Step 1: Bring up the inventory
Step 2: Click the button marked "Weapon Sets"
Step 3: Make sure all four options have checkmarks in them

Div · Apr 17, 2008, 11:51 AM // 11:51

Obviously you want a higher energy pool for casting mind blast, but in general that is the only skill you should be casting in a 30/-2 set. There's no point in having the higher total energy while taking an energy regen hit when casting stuff like immolate, rodgorts, or ward on a MB bar.

blaise · Apr 17, 2008, 03:19 PM // 15:19

My main char is ele, in a very long time i hade a big issue with losing all my energy in a battle but since time past by i never lose my energy to 0 there are skills that give my + energy and it does damage, so i use a few combos with skills that deal damage and bring my energy up its not all abouth casting mass nuke skills till your energy is 0 rather do less damage in a max longer battle

Cebe · Apr 17, 2008, 03:27 PM // 15:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by holymasamune

Obviously you want a higher energy pool for casting mind blast, but in general that is the only skill you should be casting in a 30/-2 set.

And even then you only sometimes need to do that when fighting enemy Elementalists. Any other monster is fine.

Tyla · Apr 17, 2008, 03:28 PM // 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by bj91x

Max energy "is" "part" of e-management... They're not different things...

I'll just put it this way.
You're not 'managing' your energy by having a larger energy pool. You're just enlarging it.

Managing energy is either cutting the energy cost of skills (GoLE, Expertise) or just making it go up in time.

Tearz1993 · Apr 17, 2008, 03:37 PM // 15:37

All Ele's should just read the thread title...